Push starting

Ed · Joined: 26 Jul 2006 Posts: 99 Location: Jonesville Mi

I was witness to an event this past weekend,maybe I am misstaken but it looked as if a pony stock where push started. This would be impossible unless some one had tamped with the "stock" working of the car. I know how it works. With the lock up converters simply toggle switch them and bang direct drive. this allows "cheating" because you converted should only lock up under certain conditions and push starting is not one of them. I have set back and "trolled" this board and have built and help as many racers as I can but man that just seems like flat out cheating. Direct drive in a pony stock. I have not been there enough to know names but some one else could help me with that.

Dennis ONeil · Joined: 26 Jul 2006 Posts: 426 Location: Eaton Rapids

Ed, I understand how a lockup torque converter works. I don't see how a locked up converter would allow for push starting. The pump has to be turning to create the hydraulic pressure needed to engage the clutches in an automatic. Therefore if the engine is not running the pump is not going to be turning. Perhaps the torque converter was locked and the engine would stall when put in gear and the push truck got the car rolling so it could be put in gear without stalling the engine.
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Ed · Joined: 26 Jul 2006 Posts: 99 Location: Jonesville Mi

This car sounded like it had a dead battery. I could be wrong but the car was being pushed with engine off. Then fired. I wasn't close enough to see all the details just looks fishy.

lansingsportsrage.com · Joined: 26 Jul 2006 Posts: 1085

Dennis.. how does the converter get locked up ? I thought lock out torque converters were illegal ?

torg38 · Joined: 27 Jul 2006 Posts: 94

An automatic transmission is not able to be push started no matter what. The pump is in the front of the Trans and is turned by the engine. So if you push the car the output shaft spins but the clutches are not engaged and the engine will not turn over. Further the TCC (torque converter clutch) is feed by pressure from the pump. So again if the engine isn't running the torque converter is unable to engage.
PS the only exception to push starting auto transmissions is that in the late 60's ford (I think) had a duel pump transmission. And in a power glide, TCI makes a servo lever that has to be used with a direct drive coupler. None of the pony’s are RWD so none of them can be push started.
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Ed · Joined: 26 Jul 2006 Posts: 99 Location: Jonesville Mi

The tcc soliniod is electronic and can be over ridden. I have changed a bunch. I am a mechanic that is why I wrote this post. I just wrote what I seen. I know that in the dodge trucks with diesels you can install manual switches to over ride the computer. more power. I figure this will also work in all lock up application. I don't race there I don't really care but it just seemed funny. stock cars my a22!

bone · Joined: 16 Aug 2006 Posts: 37

was this car maybe a manual???
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torg38 · Joined: 27 Jul 2006 Posts: 94

Ed · Joined: 26 Jul 2006 Posts: 99 Location: Jonesville Mi

Don't know never tried. Manuals aren't legal in your pony class.

torg38 · Joined: 27 Jul 2006 Posts: 94

http://www.spartanspeedway.com/Info/2006Rulebook.pdf

Try this link...Mg
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Effort equals results...Penske
Their is only air in my tires, Like your head...Evernham

Ed · Joined: 26 Jul 2006 Posts: 99 Location: Jonesville Mi

OK so I went to the link and it said what it said the last time I read the rules. "Stock only" And in the transmission section automatic only and stock converters with no alterations.