Back to the
main site

 
 FAQFAQ    SearchSearch  RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

The sole intent of this board is to provide an option to communicate quickly and effectively with the racing community. Any post considered to be mean-spirited in nature or contains false information will be deleted. Questions and comments are welcome and should be forwarded to spartanspeedway@gmail.com.
Click to View All Messages within 24 hours

Proposed Rule Change
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic     Forum Index -> Pony Stocks
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
John Conroy



Joined: 29 Jul 2006
Posts: 10

PostPosted: Fri Nov 24, 2006 8:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm going out on a limb here to say. I'll stick with my chevy. It's called racin. Not to be cloak and dagger, but to have the ability to work in your garage building a car to see the ultimate results on a Friday or Saturday night. Mark and Jerry have been nothing but helpful to us Conroys and many of the other ponystock teams. I think I can run with the neons. We'll see when my chevy comes out of the box next season. Work with what you got cause you is what you is, cause if you is what you ain't, you aint what you is.


Respectfully,
John Twisted Evil
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Jerry Garland



Joined: 26 Jul 2006
Posts: 145

PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2006 11:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Patrick,

All the cars that we have built have had to have weight added to them to make weight. I dont know how or what you have (as far as weight) but most cars need weight added to them. I dont know where you are getting your info about most cars being over weight but I will have to disagree. I know my old cavalier was under weight and I added 40lbs to make weight. marks neon had to have weight added. I want to say that the shadow that we used to run was the only car that we didnt add weight too? Mark can correct me if I am wrong.

John Conroy,

thanks for the kind words and your welcome!! We are glad to help anytime.

Right now as for the pony rules I think we should just leave them alone in the weight department and concentrate on the tires, because now that maurice has gotten the rule changed on the tires all teams will be scrambling come the 07 season. So start doing your homework now boys and girls!!

Jerry
_________________
Torg Motorsports!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
TA33



Joined: 27 Jul 2006
Posts: 14

PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2006 12:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Patrick,

My car weighs in at 2375 with me in it, and I'm not a small girl ! Wink



As far as the tires....NOT happy....NOT interested in racing without the Sumitomos!!

Tina
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Mopar93



Joined: 26 Jul 2006
Posts: 938
Location: Charlotte, Michigan

PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2006 1:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TA33 wrote:

As far as the tires....NOT happy....NOT interested in racing without the Sumitomos!!


Here's the intention of the new tire rule for the Pony Stocks:

We always get complaints about this car or that car having too much horsepower. Well, it's true, some cars have more horsepower (actually torque) than others and they get a distinct advantage off the corners. A tire that sticks well let's them use that torque to get a better run off the corners and it translates into more speed down the straightaway. They pass cars without any problem.

By limiting the amount of grip on the front tires of these front wheel drive cars, some of that horsepower advantage will be taken away. This will help even up the competition and lessen the complaints.

Those who know how to make their cars handle while keeping them legal and also those who know how to drive their cars will be the top teams in 2007.

Rather than forcing everyone to buy a specific front tire, we've left it to where you can choose the tire you want to run within the limits of the rules. This way, those who cannot afford new tires can keep on running cheap used tires on the front provided they are not Sumitomos.

-Maurice
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
TA33



Joined: 27 Jul 2006
Posts: 14

PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2006 1:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Maurice & anyone else who would like my opinion,

I understand what your trying to say. But, if the horsepower advantage of the faster cars is taken away then it stands to reason the same is true for the slower cars. (the faster cars are slower, the slower cars are even slower) In my opinion, all your doing is creating a field of cars that have less control due to the loss of grip. That just sounds unsafe to me to say the least. AND, Although your not forcing EVERYONE to buy a specific front tire, you are forcing the majority of us to!!
If this is not true please explain.(You know some of us just don't get it)
Ok I'm done. For now. Confused
Tina
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Mopar93



Joined: 26 Jul 2006
Posts: 938
Location: Charlotte, Michigan

PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2006 2:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Tina,

It's OK to post your opinion. And it's OK to post a question when you don't quite understand.

Let me explain this a little further.

This tire rule was not intended to be aimed at affecting how your car corners going into the corner and in the middle of the corner while you're still off the throttle. Although it will definitely slow you down in those parts of the track. But it will affect everyone similarly.

However, while you are accelerating off the corner and on the gas, some cars will slip the front tires and not accelerate very well. Meanwhile, a car with less torque may or may not reach the limit of that same tire while coming off the corner. If a car can't spin the front tires, the new rule won't hurt that car coming off the corner. But it will hurt those with more torque. Also, while spinning the front tires, the car won't turn very well. The driver will have to drive with less throttle off the corner. This will equate to less effective horsepower off the corners and will equal up the cars at this point. Remember, our front tires are our driving tires and also our steering tires. You can't spin the tires and hope to turn very well.

We got to where 90 percent of the field was running within 1.2 seconds from fastest to slowest near the end of 2006. This was very good and made for good competition. I'm guessing this number will drop to maybe 8 tenths of a second with the new tire rule.

As far as sliding all over the track, that will be up to how you drive your car. You can put Sumitomos on all four corners and still go sliding all over the track. It's been proven. Just overdrive the car and it will happen. You'll always drive to the limit of the tires.

As far as coming off the corner, the tires will limit how much usable torque you can have.

The slower cars will run about the same. The in-between cars might be a little slower. The hot dogs should slow down the most.

Remember, we're also limiting the camber next year. That will also slow a few cars down.

I think it will be much more difficult to get in the 16's next year.

-Maurice
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
TA33



Joined: 27 Jul 2006
Posts: 14

PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2006 3:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Maurice,
Thanks for explaining. 2007 should be interesting.

Tina
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
KT



Joined: 13 Aug 2006
Posts: 144

PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2006 4:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The fast cars will still be fast and slow cars will still be slow but now you have just upped the cost for these teams. This is a budget/beginner class and almost every rule change costs money, this one is no different.

I have witnessed the SLM on MANY different tires at K-Zoo and it is the same guys up front no matter what. It will be the same in the ponies in 2007.

Why is it the responsibility of the track to slow down the fast cars? Isn't it the responsibility of the other teams to work and find speed? I thought that was what racing is about, but I guess I'm wrong.

Keith
_________________
Keith

www.myspace.com/ktfor3
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
lansingsportsrage.com



Joined: 26 Jul 2006
Posts: 1078

PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2006 4:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

For what its worth... I think we are going to be just fine on these tire rules.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Mopar93



Joined: 26 Jul 2006
Posts: 938
Location: Charlotte, Michigan

PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2006 5:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

KT wrote:
The fast cars will still be fast and slow cars will still be slow

That's because the fast guys usually do their homework and they tend to work on their cars more. That's a good thing and I'm not about to change that.

Quote:

but now you have just upped the cost for these teams.


No we haven't. Everybody has to buy tires one way or another. We're just telling them what they "cannot" buy. Plus we're limiting them on how much they can spend.

Quote:
and almost every rule change costs money

Except for this one.

Quote:

Why is it the responsibility of the track to slow down the fast cars?

We aren't necessarily slowing down the fast cars, but maybe taking away an unfair advantage that some of them might have. We want it to boil down to who is the best at setting up their car and who is the best at driving it.

Quote:

Isn't it the responsibility of the other teams to work and find speed?

Yes, and they will still have to work at it. Because the fast guys will still be faster than they are until they learn to do their homework and work on their cars and learn how to drive them.

Quote:
but I guess I'm wrong.
Oh.. ok.

Over the past few seasons, there has been way too much grumbling about 3 or 4 teams winning the bulk of the races. And there has been complaints about big fat motors and stuff. For 2007, we're going to try and cure that problem somwhat.

-Maurice
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
TA33



Joined: 27 Jul 2006
Posts: 14

PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2006 7:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

How do you figure the tire change isn't going to cost us all more money?
One set of Sumitomos per season vs. Numerous sets of "cheap" tires? Hmmm wonder which way is more cost effective.
I've tried the cheap tires- they wear out FAST, and blow out easily- which causes more accidents- I know I've been there. Now we have to give up a tire that is proven to be the best for us and are reasonably priced -to trial and error at different tires to find something as good? What the ****! And if someone finds just the right tire the first race, are people going to complain about that person and say they are cheating? Then, is that tire going to be banned also?? Perhaps we should all use donut spares and call it good. Do we actually get to have engines in our cars or do we go Flintstone style?
My gripe here isn't the cost so much as the "If it ain't broke don't fix it"

Tina Laughing
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Mopar93



Joined: 26 Jul 2006
Posts: 938
Location: Charlotte, Michigan

PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2006 8:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Remember at the start of 2006 when we were talking about implementing a "spec" tire? We held off and said we might wait until the middle of the season. Everybody said we should leave it alone for the whole year. So we did. Now it's next year.

We didn't do a spec tire, but we made a compromise. We're not telling you what you have to run, we're only telling you what you can't run.

Instead of complaining, someone should start a new thread in the Pony Stock section titled "Pony Stock Tire ideas". Post information about tires you've researched and what you think about them, what others have found out about them, etc.

Figure out what might be the next best thing to the Sumitomo tire. Pictures, specs, and reviews are available on the internet. At tirerack.com, there are 29 different 195/70-14 tires priced under $75.

Somebody get the ball rolling. This would be Pony Stock teams helping other Pony Stock teams.

-Maurice
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
TA33



Joined: 27 Jul 2006
Posts: 14

PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2006 8:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Did we hit a nerve???

Tina
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Mopar93



Joined: 26 Jul 2006
Posts: 938
Location: Charlotte, Michigan

PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2006 9:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

Did we hit a nerve???

Nah, I can take it. Cool

I might add something... It's generally understood that the Sumitomo tire was the best tire on our FWD cars at Spartan. It was noticeably faster than any other tire.

Now, take that tire away. What's the best tire now? I'd guess that there are a half dozen tires that would probably be fairly competitive with each other without any one single tire showing much of an advantage.

What this means is that even if you guess wrong on the choice of tires, you probably won't make a real big mistake. That's why everyone should get their heads together and start working on this subject.

Make your own spec tire amongst yourselves.

-Maurice
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
12M



Joined: 24 Nov 2006
Posts: 6
Location: OLIVET

PostPosted: Tue Nov 28, 2006 8:36 am    Post subject: tires Reply with quote

I am building a pony for 2007. I sold tires for several years and Im sure there is another tire that will work as well as the sumitomos. Why not make the sumitomos the only tire you can use. Or pick another tire and make every one use the same tire. Marice said everyone has to buy tires so pick a tire and everyone can use the same one. I not raced at Spartan so maybe I have no idea but I think if you stop letting people use a tire this year next year there will be another tire you cant use. Just my thoughts.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic     Forum Index -> Pony Stocks All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
Page 2 of 4

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group