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fuel question

 
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Drake Racing 14 28
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 3:03 pm    Post subject: fuel question Reply with quote

hey who ever is running tech i've got a question. as i was driving by a shell station i saw a sign the said "we have e85" also i read an article that said that e 85 has an octance rating of 105. well i was thinking what about running e85 in my pure stock. would that be against the rules or would it be allowable since it's an alternitive fuel and is being sold commercially at a local gas station.
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Mopar93



Joined: 26 Jul 2006
Posts: 938
Location: Charlotte, Michigan

PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 3:13 pm    Post subject: Re: fuel question Reply with quote

Drake Racing 14 28 wrote:
well i was thinking what about running e85 in my pure stock. would that be against the rules

That's something we haven't considered. However, it's not pump gas, it's mostly alcohol. Until we get together and actually discuss it, my guess is we won't allow it.

If we did allow it, you'd have to make some changes to your fuel system to allow for it. Your jetting will be way off. And unless you cheat and raise your compression ratio, you'd probably produce less horsepower even with the correct jetting and timing. I'd suggest sticking to pump gas.

Quote:

or would it be allowable since it's an alternitive fuel and is being sold commercially at a local gas station.

You can't use that for a reason. Natural gas is also sold at a local gas station. And so is propane.

-Maurice
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Drake Racing 14 28
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 3:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ok it's just something that i thought of today on my way home.
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lansingsportsrage.com



Joined: 26 Jul 2006
Posts: 1078

PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 3:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

While E-85 has a 105 octane rating, it burns like crap and produces 28% less power per unit of volume then regular gas.

Running a non-FFV with a high percentage of ethanol will cause the air fuel mixture to be leaner than normal in carbureted or open loop fuel injection engines, and cause closed loop fuel injection systems to adjust for the increase in oxygen content of the fuel mixture. A lean mixture, when leaner than stoichiometric, is unlikely to cause heat related engine damage because temperature decreases quickly once there is a surplus of air during the combustion event. The surplus air cools the burn, and lowers the exhaust gas temperature. The effects of surplus oxygen on the catalytic converter may be undesirable, and if too lean the engine will display roughness in operation. If the percentage of ethanol used results in sustained operation in the range between stoichiometric and best power mixture, problems may develop. In this range, between peak exhaust gas temperature and approximately 50 degrees rich of peak, combustion temperatures are at the highest possible, and may exceed the design temperatures for the engine. Detonation margins are reduced, and if operation at elevated temperatures is allowed to persist over considerable periods of time, heat related damage to valves and pistons can occur.

Without in-depth knowledge of the engine's mixture control system and instrumentation to monitor exhaust gas temperature, cylinder head temperature, cylinder pressure, and/or exhaust oxygen content, it is difficult to know whether the engine is operating in the "red" zone, or an acceptable mixture zone. Closed loop fuel injection systems eliminate much of the risk. This is also why the check engine light will illuminate if you mix more than around 50% to 60% E85 by volume with your gasoline in a non-FFV. If this happens, just add more 87 octane regular grade gasoline as soon as possible to correct the problem. (Some premium blends contain up to 10% ethanol; to correct the problem as quickly as possible, always add regular grade gasoline, not premium grade gasoline.) These fuel/air mixture related problems will not happen in a properly-converted vehicle.

^
|--- from wikipedia
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Drake Racing 14 28
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 3:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ok thanks patrick. yea the e85 was an idea but it just wouldn't be sutible for racing. to get it even close to regular gas it'd take alot of work and just spend as much time getting the fuel right, where that time could be spent tuning the handling. thanks for anwsering my question.
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lansingsportsrage.com



Joined: 26 Jul 2006
Posts: 1078

PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 3:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just realized I sounded a lot like Trick answering that question..

ACK !

Read here for the full details

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E85_in_standard_engines
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Drake Racing 14 28
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 3:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

lol i wonder when either that new guy smarterthantricknology or tricknology will chim in on this lol. thanks though it sounded like a good idea but the details make it almost impossible.
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